20H makeover for Cardinals

[Marsha Finley]

Flks:
I have a 20H that I want to make over as a Cardinal tank. The challenge is that I have 7.6 ph fromthe tap, and Ihave to do peat filtering etc to amintain a steady ph...
I want to use primarily biotope apropriate plants , but also maintain a scale appropriate for cardinals...
Does anyone have suggestions for a planting plan? This is a long-range project, so feel free to elucidate! All commcnts considered and appreciated!

[RTRJR]

My personal approach to fish is that they are adaptable and I am terminally lazy. My tap is moderately hard and alkaline, and I have had no issue keeping cardinals in unmodified tap. The last school I kept had 50% survival at six years in my care (they were small wild-caught initially), so I did not see any decrease in their lifespan, nor any fading or loss of color.

I'm not up on biotopes, so I'll leave that to others.<edited><editID>RTRJR</editID><editDate>37951.6725347222</editDate></edited>

[sherrymitchell]

Just recently I found that I could "crash" the pH of my
normally 7.6 pH water by overdosing with Amquel. I
found this out quite by accident. The pH went from
7.6 down to 6.5 in 48 hours. So now, I'm wondering
if I can use that to my advantage to create acidic
water for my acid loving fish.... Amquel is not
supposed to be toxic to the fish..    Also, if I was to
mix the low pH amquel water with rainwater, it would
be softer too and more hospitable to the cardinals
and such..... right?

[Ghazanfar Ghori]

[QUOTE=sherrymitchell] Just recently I found that I could "crash" the pH of my
normally 7.6 pH water by overdosing with Amquel. [/QUOTE]

Whats the chemistry behind that?
I've got to do some tests!

[Marsha Finley]

Description of sudden ph drop at:
<a href="http://www.petsforum.com/novalek/kpd51.htm" target="_blank">Petsforum Amquel page</a>

[RTRJR]

If they are blackwater fish and you want the look, why not just use driftwood, or peat extraction? Peat would be more controlable, but tannins do eat light if you want it planted.

The pH crashes tend to take out nitrification bacteria; not an issue for ammonia at very acid pH, iffy for nitrite if it ever gets to that stage.

[m.milliner]

I believe a few plants from the cardinal habitat might be:

Any echinodorus from South America
Alternathera reinecki
Stargrass
Brazilian pennywort
Myriophyllum
Vals
Frogbit
Water hyacinth

[Marsha Finley]

which of the Frogbit family is from SA? I thought one was from Europe, 1 from Asia.. Must be another!

I had Alternathera reinecki.. It grew by leaps and bounds for 1 week, tehn totally stopped. The info that I found said that it's a bog plant, does better emmersed vs. sub... What is your experience with it? Hints?

[sherrymitchell]

<<Whats the chemistry behind that?
I've got to do some tests!>>

I age my water in gallon jugs and by dosing with 20-
30 drops of Amquel I've experienced a sudden drop
in pH over 48 hours.   With 20 drops per gallon
(about 1/8 teaspoon) I get the following:

From the tap --         &nbs p; 7.6

After 24 hours --        7.4

After 48 hours --        7.0

After 72 hours --        6.5

Higher doses of the Amquel produce quicker pH
drops. For instance, 1/4 teaspoon of Amquel in one
gallon of water brought the pH down to 6.0 after 48
hours.   I've been experimenting with water and
different declor products for a couple of weeks now.
Interesting results.

sherry

[Marsha Finley]

<img border="0" src="smileys/smiley20.gif" border="0">
Sounds like what I need! I've been using the Seachem Acid Bufffer with mixed results... Along with Peat and driftwood for the tannins

Marhsa